again, thanks for watching. i am bill o' -- flummery. we are definitely looking out for you. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> sean: welcome to hannity, the victims of the scabbed scanned have broken their silence. a powerful hearing on pitol hill when average americans who were unfairly targeted by this administration told their personal stories to lawmakers for the very first time. at times the testimony got heated and even emotional. let's take a look at the highlights from today's hearings. >> i was born free american woman, wife, mother and citizen. i'm telling my government that you forgotten our place. i'm not interested in scoring political points.

i want to protect and preserve the america that i grew up in the america that people crossed oceans and risked their lives to be a part of. i am terrified that the is slipping away. >> thank you very much. [ applause ] >> i felt betrayed. absolutely ayed. >> then acting commissioner steve miller summed up the irs action as horrible customer service. did you call that horrible customer service or would you call it something else? >> i would call eight felony. i would prosecute those people responsible. >> representative, it's your kind of statements that have empowered irs agents to make determinations about which organizations qualify for the public good and which do not. [ applause ] >> the notion that defending traditional marriage does not qualify as defense of the public

is preposterous. >> acan people are led to believe that you are big muscles of political strength. could you tell us roughly what your annual budget is? >> our annu budget is in negative. >> are you a democratic organization. [ laughter ] >> this irs agency has discriminated genetics people based on their political views. >> for anyone to suggest that these individuals should be limited more so than oers because of their political beliefs is nothing more than discrimination. >> sean: that suggestion was made early and often by democrats at the proceedings. jim mcdermit suggested that the victims are to blame for this scandal. now thankfully there was a former vice presidential nominee to call him out. watch this moment. >>ach these groups are highly political in opposing the president's

healthcare reform to gay marriage and abortion restrictions, you are infringed i the controversial issues in the country. with your applications you were asking the american public to pay for that. >> mr. ryan is recognized. response to what i just in heard. [ cheers and applause ] >> mr. chairman -- >> so you you are to blame is the message here is to suggest that these citizens are to blame for applying -- i don't understand how anyone can make that conclusion. >> sean: joining me is with reaction is chairman and conssman ve cam. the reaction and i applause,

i watched a lot of hearings in my life. that is notomething you see every day on capitol hill, is it? >> no, it's not. it really is a statement how compelling a lot of what we heard was. we're oary americans who did a tremendous job stating our case. the quality of the testimony was really impressive and troubling because of what the irs has done and they targeted people simply because they had conservative political ws. >> sean: it really comes down to that. that is not in dispute. was your reacts to statements of jim mcdermott? >> it was preposterous to make that connection, they were law abiding citizens that were organizing under first amendment rights and as many pointed out, don't use taxpayer funds. it's something they were entitled to do.

they are entitled to not be discriminated against. you really need to hear those stories personally. to actually see the age americans who came from all over the country and what they represented, the hundreds of people, i think it was important to put a face on this. >> seaoi lerner knew about this in june of 20 11-the irs concluded their ownnternal investigation in may of 2012. are you able to telle american people why they didn't know about this before the 2012 election, sir? we can't yet. we know t high ranking officials at irs and two knew a year ago.ow treasury we don't know who really started this yet. that will be the painstaking part of this investigation that is just beginning wherereally have to dig in and get sort of that kind of information.

they have not been forth coming. they have not been able to tell us either the irs or inspector general. we're going to have to dig and get it on our own. it's gone on for several rs and it's going to take some time. >> president said you heard it from the news? >> that was his a statement. >> we were told originally that nobody in the white hous knew. we have since found out that the white house council new early than they told. the white house chief of staff newly than was told about and stephanie cutter knew about it. it's important to hear from the victims. why has nobody from the white house been put under h and asked any questions about it? >> well, know trry department knew about it over a year ago. the treasury is obviously directly connected to the white house. we are going to get th we have to go about this in the most painstaking and

authentic wwe can. we'regoing to do that. we're going to take it where it leads. by the time we get done with this, we're going to get to the truth. we don't know it now. it's not easy to find out the things we do know we'll keep going until we do. >> sean: i'm following this like everybody else the bush years, the head of the irs went to the white house one time versus 157 trips since president obama was president. can you rcile that for me? >> it doesn't make sense for me either. we don't know what those visits were. i think we had an inadequate explanation that the former commissioner attended. there are a lot more questions there. what was the substance of the meetingsnd bet if we back over time, that is unusual number. >> sean: in light that we 16,000 employees from the

irs are going to be overseeing the healthcare bill. is that something you think the country needs to reconsider in light of the abuse of power that clearly went on here? >> this isan agency that is at best terribly misimagined and at worst engaging in illegal activit this is the agency that is goingto enforce obamacare. >> sean: congressman, thank u so much. we'll keep asking important questions. juan williams will square off with a woman whoaims she was unfairly targeted by the irs. later, another scandal is rocking the white house. a.p. is reporting that many members of the cabinet are using secret email addresses to avoid freedom of information act requests. and you can pick the video today.

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. >> sean: one of more interesting things about

targeting conservatives is how democratic members that the agents were doing their job and none of it was politically motivated. >> i get the feeling that many of you and republican colleagues don't believe they should be free from political targeting b free from any scrutiny at all. >> it doesn't have anything all of the irs versus blue. commissioners have been republican appointees appointed by george bush. between 2004 and 2006 many lial groups including naacp, a progressive church environmental group were targeted by the bush administration. where was the outrage then? >> the inspector general in his report he found based

on his interviews in the preinary investigation re was no political motivation behind what was going on. now, there are reports there were progressive groups that were singled out as well. >> sean: jng us is poal analyst juan williams and katherine, she was she was unfairly targeted by the irs and other federal agencies. welcome both and good to see you. >> good to see you, sean. >> sean: it was not just the irs there were other federal agencies that went after you. up sum up your story? >> we filed in july 2010 for a nonprofit we are still waiting for that. since then we have been visited by the f.b.i., by the irs personally and private business by atf, by the texas branch of the epa and -- my word. there are five agencies.

osha, all surprising to us, never befo had we been anything like this prior to filing the appli. >> sean: the difference, juan, can you name another indication where there was widespread targeting of peple because of their political v any that can you think of? >> as you just heard from the coss people, naacp, greenpeace, planned parenthood said that during theush years they thought they were fairly untargeted for irs audits. at the time the bush people said there was nothing unfair. they. >> sean: in this case, they admitted it. the irs has admitted that they were targeting conservative groups. that is a huge difference. >> i agree. let me say when you play the tape from congressman mcdermott, he said it's long to target any one political ideology and then

went on to say, it's not the case that people who get involved with politics are somehow exempt to see if they truly qualify for a exempt atus as charities socialelfare groups because think may be playing poli. >> sean: we got transcripts we got yesterday. we went through a lot of these last night. the administration was saying this was all coming from cincinnati, the cincinnati people now through these transcripts are saying that is not true. they are suggesting that washington made the req, washington, quote, told them they wanted some of the cases. one guy said he resigned he didn't want to be associated with targeting groups. what does that say to you? >> i mean that is absolutely concurrent with what we heard what we were three years now going on -- trying to figure out what took all the weird conditions and why is this taking so long?

we were told on more than one occasion by more than one analystey were getting marching orders from washington. >> sean: ma what about the changing story. does it make you suspici they said it was rogue people in d.c. and people in cincinnati are saying that is is not true? >> i don't think we know that. again, there was a lady e the congress today that was crying and saying this i the america she grew up. she w that america back and talking about oppression. the fact is people are going to get reviewed when they say they are non-political and get involved in politicalvities. >> sean: they were thring us under the bus, that is one member saying. as an agency we have to submit many reports, the chances of two being rogue could never happen.

>> we're talking about being told in washington put the proper review on these groups because there was sudden rush of groups after the supreme court case and they want to make sure the groups weren't playing games. so th got a tax exemption while invon a political activity. >> i would like to speak to that when you file an application you have to be ready to answer questions and maybe even another round. that is wh have come to learned as customary procedure. to be asking hundred donors are when you shouldn't have to disclose that. to be asked in committee hearings about which names of minors that may hav come in contact with your curriculum was the bill of rules. at some point it goes beyondhat. >> hold on a second. catherine, if you are getting money for ptical purposes, mostly engaged in

political activities, trying to stop obama, don't you think that is going to affect your tax status? >> i think when you find agency come forward and said they have profiled groups based on their ideology, based on buzz words. then we find out the same agency has released names of donors to other groups, that is criminal offense. we got testimony today. catherine, you shouldn't have gone through what you went through. you are going to enjoy us on special friday night. they will tell their story right here on hannity. cominp our panel but a scathing reported about top members of obama's cabinet usingret email addresses, so much for transparency where they try to duck freedom of information requests. rand paul will weigh i you get to vote on tonight's video of the day. here is option number two.

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♪ ♪ ♪ >> sean: welcome back to hannity. investigation conducted by the a.p. is revealing that top obama appointees are using secret email accounts and most agencies has not turned over their lists but they have identified secret accounts including the

private email account of hhs secretary and that would be kathleen sebelius. earlier today when asked about this additional account, she this to say to fox ne >> there is no secret account. there is a public email and private email and they are all available. 28,000 emails a month come into the public emails, about 400 come into the emails. it's a management i. >> sean: while all of that may sound well and good. based on the administration's history o indifference to the fact, it's culture of corruption how can we save t it at face value? i'll leave it to jay carney, when he was asked about the email accounts, he not surprisingly refused to answer. >> the white house, like congress which i'm sure will be part of this, is

not subject to this the point -- i'm not going to get into people's individual email addresses. >> sean: she reaction rand paul. welcomeck. your reaction to all that. >> i've been kind of disappointed because there were certain aspects of president obama that i wanted to like. with all sincerity, i wanted to see a president who was truly liberal who a liberal that would defend transparency, that wouldn't be targeting the press or targeting political enemie really defending the first amendment and fourth amendment. now, we have this whole culture of corruption where we've got the secret email accounts. i mean, for example, it would be problem if they are communicating with lobbyists secretly. if they are say to certain people that mike

make money on healthcare. this is what brown down clinton's healthcare that there were secret meetings to make money in the reforms. forms of government and wel want to know who they are talking to. >> sean: are you saying he not defending certain amendments and is not specifically which ones he is not defending? >> with regard to the first amendment. the freedom of the press, the press doesn't always get it right. the press can be on the right or left on or in the middle but they are searching out news to make the rest of us accountable. i think when he targets a.p. reporters or fox news reporter,articularly the way he did it, he didn't go to a judge. he did in one case and judge made an egregious error, but the a.p. case, i think they issued an administrative subpoena which is not really a

rant. in light of the fox case nor the a.p. case, with a there is there any reason to go after the media. if someone is leaking information and you are in gonment, go after the leaker. printing the news is not breaking the law. you notice they didn't go after the media but they did tell the judge they were treating the fox news reporter, james rosen, as complicit. this is the danger. i'm not saying he is or anybody, they say a reporter is complicit to terrorism. under current day law, you bay without a trial.anamo this is president that is supposed to be a progressive defending our liberties who signed a law thou can besent a gua than guan with without a charge or trial. i am disappointed in the president and many people on the left are. >> sean: let's will list

to the president talk about freedom of information act. here is the promises he made? >> the directives i am giving my admintration today on how to interpret the freedom of information acted will do just that. for a long time there has been too much secrecy it in this city. starting today every agency and department should know this administration stands the side not on te that seek to withhold information but those to make it available. it's a most powerful instrument to make our government honest and holding it accountable. i expect members of my administration to live up to the letter but also the spirit of law. going forward any time the american people wanted know something i or a former president wants to withhold, we will have to consult with the attorney general and the white house counsel whose business it is to ensure compliance with the rule law.

information will not be withheld just becase i say so. lee say it as simply as transparency and the rule of law will be the touchstones of this presidency. >> sean: do you think that these private email accounts live up to that standard or maybe do you think they were designed to avoid foya requests? >> here is the thing when i hear the president speak, if i was sitting in the audience i would stand up and cheer. what he saying sounds so great. what he recent said about if an american were targeted for an attack, but he thinks it is himess. making a decision and not a judge or jury. when he says that, i'm not sure he really means this. i think what is happening, the constellation of scandals, benghazi, the irs, the reporters that he has targeted, i guess she losing. to me he is losing that moral authority, the moral

authoty to lead the nation. even though he sounds so great, i want to believe in what he says, he is losing that believability to the american public. >> sean: before i let you go, you got in a little conflict with senator john mccain and recent trip to syria. there is a photograph taken of him with two men who according to beirut news reports that were involved in kidnapping of a group of people from lebanon. your concern about having involvement in syria, i share your concerns because it reminds me of egypt. what are your concerns here? >> here is my point. i never mentioned his name. my point it's difficult to tell friends from both, even in afghanistan we've been there ten years and much more stable. we have soldiers in the afghan army who are allies

who shoot our soldiers in the back. we are going into syria and going to be allied with al-qaeda fighting this rege who are bad guys, allied with al-qae and we're going to say, are i part of al-qaeda and they are going to say no and we're going to give them missiles and expect them they are telling the truth. hard to vet who your friends are. you give it to islamic rebel who has will be shootingistians on the other side. i have a problem with it. >> sean: on the immigration bill, a lot of conservatives are saying, not enough border security. they are not supporting it. where do you stand it? >> it's got to have mo border security to get my vote. i've told them what it would . i have an amendment that says we know what border security is we don't wait for the administration. if they will come and talk to me, i want to be for immigration reform but i can't unless we have

stronger border security. >> sean: still ahead tonight. dana perino and stuart varney expose the truth about obamacare. first, karl rove is live a whether eric holder will be able to survive as attorney general. we want to hear from you. hannity live.foxnews.com. sneak peek, the jokehat brought the house down on the number one late night show. >> president obama says she renewing his efforts to close guantanamo bay. how about closing the irs, why don't we do that?oftball. and tea parties. i'll have more awkward conversations than i'm equipped for, because i'm raising two girls on my own. i'll worry about the economy more than a few times before they're grown. but it's for them, so i've found a way.

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this is no at a political pursuit. >> if it was not political why are only conservative groups being targeted? really. name one, name one. one liberal group had tea parnd patriot in the name and it was targeted. this is single liberal group -- >> no, i'm not. not at all. this was not an effort driven by the white house. it would be the dumbest political effort of all time. >> sean: david and karl rove, the man himself, name one? >> name one. >> sean: couldn't do it? >> it was a remarkable episod one of the most interesting things was, he said look, this all happened because it was a remarkable influx of applications for tax exempt status at the irs. it got overwhelmed. axelrod says the irs was

flooded with applications. will have her her said as well on may 15th, she said there was a big uptick in these applications. i decided to do a little research. i have an excellent research assistant and she found a list, sirs. i'm going to put this on foxnews.com tomorrow. the link to the official docu regarding the completions by fiscal year. follow me on this. this is 501c4, tax exempt organizations and elsewhere under the direction of lois lerner most recently. applications for tax exempt status peaked in fiscal 2007. they peaked at 87,638, and

have been in decline every year since then. in fact the last and most recent year, 54,522 for tax exempt status and of 2,744 was 501c4, in this one there was 35,000 more than last year. that is down from the previous year, 2009, it's 70,000 applicati for tax exempt status. they started this 2010 because they had an influx. the flynn flux,t's down! it's down 15% to to and down 9% for 501c4s. >> sean: sohat spin is contradicted. eric holder has been contradicted. he had come out with the doj, oops, the rosen case and we know that benghazi stories have been

contradicted. what do you conclude? >> shredding their own credibility. i could believe thing with hold are. he goesore congress on the 1h of may and says, i would have nothing to do with this kind of thing at all. then, of course, tcome out today and had to acknowledge since then that he had. they are trying to somehow squar the circle, saying i didn't have anything to do with it and i did it. and the explanations are making it worse. they should have said he misspoke. it makes sense, we went to our third , two judges turned us down and third judge granted our subpoena and we were says n was a flight risk and but we didn't really meani. it -- conspiracy. we would never have prosecuted him. so they lied to the judge. >> sean: either lied to the judge or congress. can he survive?

>> he shouldn't but it all depends on obama. if prent obama says i'm not willing to part with holder and i'm willing to suffer the damage, he will not go. it's not helpful for president obama who is clearly as seen as lying to congress. there is something more troubling. there are a series of specific guidelines, the number is 19-300-400, guidelines in place governing the actions of the department of justice when it c to seeking the phone records of a journalist like this. if you try to do it you have to use every other possible meanings to get the information. they could have done that by looking at state department employee. >> sean: a would you say to obama, what does he need to do if he wants to get outside from underneath this? >> he needs to say somebody has to say holder is

hurting you and it's time to go and you have to reluctantly need to accept the resition. >> sean: like your new white board. >> bombing has to have the gigantic board. he has the big one. >> sean: and remember president obama would lower your premiums in obamaca, those claims are not true and still vote on hasn't in it live/foxnews.com for the video of the day. [ male announcer ] erica had a rough day.

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♪ ♪ ♪ >> sean: welcome back to hannity. i hate to say it. now, the disastrous implications of obamacare are starting to be felt all first, let's listen to the

president in his own words as he tried to sell you, the american people, on obamacare, remember this. >> nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage of the doctor you that is why my proposal where most americans get their health insurance from their employer. if you like your plan you can keep your pn. >> we will start by reducing premiums by as much as $2500 per family. >> that is why i met with representatives of insurance and drug companies, doctors and hospitals and labor unions who are pledging to do their part to redu healthcarets. >> our cost cutting measures mirror most of the proposals in the current senate bill which reduces most people's premiums and brings down our deficit by up to one trillion doll over the next decade because we are spending our healthcare dollars more wisely. >> sean: unfortunately none of that is true. here is the latest examples. in california, individual

priums will increase as much as 146%, a stagering figure, but that i not a. according to the latest cbo rep millions of people will remain uninsured es obamacare. o projects 31 million people industrial not have healthnsurance. ning me with reaction, our friend stuart varney o dana perino. apparently either those numbers are right or obama is right or the act ear numbers are right. >> dana: i'm going to go with the act ear. without trying the negativesr obamac are und 55%. i think that is probably low. that was most recent poll. what you have is the failure of hope over experience. as it is playi out the hope pas shot happening. it won't before the deadline of014. >> sean: look at the headlines, rage and shock,

obamacare to increase indivl health insurance by up to 146%. coboninsured under obamacare never falls below 30 million. what does that mean? is there a chance of getting it overturned? >> stuart: i see an opportunity here to defund thedefund the irs as the police force of obama came. if you can defund the irs, you could backdoor defund obama care and stop it in its tracks. after what we have seen today, these irs scandals, i think we have a good shot at getti the pocal supp to say to the irs,ou are not going to be part of obama care at all. get out ofit thatllows us to stop obama care in i tracks. >> how manpeople are supposed to be hired for the implementation? >> thousands. in fact, one of those things that a.j. just said today, they are going to make sure tha

every document of obama care is aable 150 uages. maybe that something we should be doing as anmen but i also think that there was a much bett way to imove health insurance. what happened with this is that they have got all the good stuff u were worried about your child and they were c out of college and didn't have a job, you worried about them, health insurance, that's okay, cause they can be on until they are 26. all the stuff they ed was at the beginning. now, when the bill becoming due, former speaker pelosi had to put out a 78-page document too help members to go home and tell everybody how great it is. >> it is socialized medicine. i am an englishman born and raised in britain. i know all about socialized medicine. i know about social systems that are falling to pieces becau they are run by government. that's what obama care is. it must be reversed. >> let's go to theolitical point dana was maki they are trying to go back home

over the fourth of july holiday and convince americans thi i a good thing. what is the political fallout? >> this is a very difficult thing to sell. the goodies, they come up front. happen right now.ginning to premiums going up. these exchanges will not be in place by october 1st. we will get the full implementation on january 1st. it is going to be chaos. the rules aren't written. the plan is not eady. >> what if is is a train wreck? >> it is a train wreck. >> assumingt is i believe it will be. we are going to ha sticker shock for people. the question is, what are the political implications? this is january of a mid-t politicallications a for a democrat. th policy implicatns are e worse. ma blackburn, chair woman, has a proposal to delay it for one year,ause it is not goto be repea in time to stop the train wreck. could they get a delay for one year so tu could look at

some ofese actuarial tables give people cidence in the d system, i think th is something the house republicans ld move. >> i thinket theotry ha their medicine. 's probably the only way you will ge repeal. >> i think chaos is com that will be the cine. the way to really t circuit this thing is to get the irs out of obama care so they canno be the force of cion pus you. >> and replace it with what? >> medical savings accounts. >> medical savin accounts are t. would love for every to hane but it is not going to do the job that the irs is going to do. >> you knowt he said ut this poor, ten-year-ol gir >> i have been seeing her a lot lately. >> she has a secret e-mail account? she says it is not r that secret. the "associated press" is the one reported on that. >> isn't that trf a lot of senior officia, private, personal e-mail accounts so you

can't get at ? >> that' true. >> i loven you two fight. >> it is still notwork. >> yhould have fought at the beginning of theegment. >> we can argue about this next week. nks,guy 't gowhere. ur choice for the video ofth that's coming up right after the break. did you pick the right one? that's t. [ male announcer ] this is kevin. to prove to you that aleve is the better choice for him, he's agreed to give it up. that's today? [ male announcer ] we'lbe with him all day as he goes back to taking lenol. i was okay, but after lunch my knee started to hurt again.

and now i've got to take more pills. ♪ yup. another pill stop. can i get my aleve back yet? ♪ for my pain, i want my aleve. ♪ [ male announcer ] look for the easy-open red arthritis cap.

welcome back to "hannity." tonight, congressman jim rubenstein's anti-obama rant, he was able to sum up in 1:02, each and every one of president barack obama's failures. what you are about to sees what you voted to are, the definitive indictment against the administration. let's take a look at the video of the day mr. speaker, the president's justice department sold weapons to marco terrorists south of our

border who killed one of our nest. the president's state depant lied about benghazi with false information provided by white house. the president's attorney general authorizedspying on a fox news journalist and his family for reporting on a north korean nuclear test. the president's justice department confiscated phone rec the "associated press,because they reported on a thwarted terrorist attack, the presiden treasury department uses the irs to target political opposition, thedent's health and human services secretary, pressures the insurance companies. she is supposed to regulate to mote obama care, which is the same law she uses to force citizens to pay for abortion-inducing drugs against their religious liberties. mr. speaker, the president's honesty, indianapolis, vens fullness and lack of moral compass lead many to suggest he is not fit to lead. the only problem is